"Here are some examples. [Part six of eight]
Satan is Jesus' Brother
Protestants have such a knee-jerk reaction to this. It really REALLY aggravates them because they take it out of context and also assume that spirit brotherhood makes Jesus and satan equals - it doesn't!
The LDS Church teaches that before the Earth was created, we all lived as spirits with God, our Heavenly Father. Since He is the Father of our spirits we are all brothers and sisters......
Why do Protestants actually agree that Jesus and satan were spirit brothers?
While Protestants disagree over the specifics of the LDS theology, they do believe in some key points - That Lucifer was created by God and that he didn't start out bad but later became evil and was cast out of God's presence. Since Lucifer was created by God that makes God his Father. Protestants believe that Jesus is the Son of God; ergo, Lucifer and Jesus (and the rest of us) are brothers since they, and we, share the same Heavenly Father." (Kelly Bingham, Why Protestants Agree With Mormons (They Just Don't Realize It), www.moroni10.com, December 7, 2007, Brackets added)
"The Bible does not teach that Jesus Christ was the spirit-brother of Lucifer. Though we could cite many passages that refute this hideous doctrine, we will limit our attention to Colossians 1:16, where we are told that the entire angelic realm--including the angel Lucifer--was personally created by Jesus Christ: "By him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they by thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him."
The little phrase "all things" means that Christ created the whole universe of things. "Every form of matter and life owes its origin to the Son of God, no matter in what sphere it may be found, or with what qualities it may be invested....Christ's creative work was no local or limited operation; it was not bounded by this little orb [earth]." Everything--whether it is simple or complex, visible or invisible, heavenly or earthly, immanent or transcendent--is the product of Christ.
Now, it is noteworthy that Paul says that Christ created "thrones," "powers," "rulers," and "authorities." In the rabbinical (Jewish) thought of the first century, these words were used to describe different orders of angels (see Romans 8:38; Ephesians 1:21; 3:10; 6:12; Colossians 2:10, 15; Titus 3:1). Apparently there was a heresy flourishing in Colossae (the city in which the Colossian Christians lived) that involved the worship of angels. In the process of worshiping angels, Christ had been degraded. So, to correct this grave error, Paul emphasizes in Colossians 1:16 that Christ is the one who created all things--including all the angels--and hence, He is supreme and is alone worthy of worship.
We know from Scripture that Lucifer is a created angelic being--a"cherub" (Ezekiel 28:13-19; cf. Isaiah 14:12-15). Since Lucifer was an angel, and since Christ created all the angels, it is clear that Christ is not a spirit-brother of Lucifer. Christ is not of the created realm; rather, He is the Creator. Lucifer and Christ are to two entirely different classes--the created and the Creator. You will want to carefully point this out to Mormons, especially when discussing verses they cite to support their deviant view that Jesus was procreated by the Father." (Reasoning from the Scriptures with the Mormons, Ron Rhodes & Marian Bodine, Harvest House Publishers, 1995, pp. 275, 276)
Sorry, Mormons and Protestants don't agree here either.
Why Protestants Agree With Mormons? Part Seven
Why Protestants Agree With Mormons? Part Six
"Here are some examples. [Part five of eight]
Baptism
The LDS Church teaches that, following faith in Christ and repentance, baptism by immersion for a remission of sins is a necessary ordinance for salvation.
Why do Protestants agree?
Actually, it depends on the particular Protestant denomination. Some believe baptism is required; others view it as a type and shadow or nice gesture of faith. There are also disputes among Protestants over the style of baptism. Some Protestant sects agree with the LDS Church that full immersion is the proper method, others are are sprinklers and some are partial dunkers." (Kelly Bingham, Why Protestants Agree With Mormons (They Just Don't Realize It), www.moroni10.com, December 7, 2007, Brackets added)
"After His death and resurrection, and just before His ascension into heaven, the Lord Jesus gave the Great Commission to His church, which was thenceforth to be its basic concern and the focus of all its activities until His return at the end of the age. The Commission consists of three parts, in the following order (see Matt. 28:18-20): (1) "Making disciples from all nations"; (2) baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost [Spirit]," and then (3) "teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you" (see also Mark 16:15, 16).
Thus, baptism is an integral part of the Christian's Commission from His Lord, and is therefore of highest importance. That the early Christians so regarded it is evident from the fact that wherever it is mentioned in the book of Acts, the above order was always observed. That is immediately after a man or woman was truly converted to Christ, he was forthwith baptized and thereby identified with the local church, where he was thereafter instructed in the full scope of Christian faith and life. Baptism was not considered as a part of the gospel, by which men are saved (1 Cor. 15:1-4), as Paul made clear when he said: "Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel" (1 Cor. 1:17), but it is an essential part of the Great Commission." (The Bible Has The Answer, Henry M. Morris, Baker Book House, 1971, pp. 142, Brackets added, Bold type added)
"The rite is nowhere described in detail. Immersion was commonly used (Mark 1:9; Acts 8:38). The outdoor environment facilitated this. It is implied in Rom. 6:4; Col. 2:12 as a picturesque symbol, if not as the essential method; but immersion was hardly possible in the prison at Philippi (Acts 16:33) or in the house of Cornelius (Acts 10:48). Whatever the form, baptism has been the ceremony necessary to identify the baptized with the Christian church;......" (Harper's Bible Dictionary, Madeleine S. Miller and J. Lane Miller, Harper & Brothers, Publishers, 1961, p. 60)
The Mormon church teaches that a person is required to be baptized in order to have forgiveness (remission) of sins in order to have salvation. Protestants do not baptize for salvation. They do baptize by immersion, however, the LDS agree with the Protestants with immersion, not the Protestants agree with the LDS. Protestants were here before the LDS.
Sorry, Mormons and Protestants do no agree on the same reasons for baptism.
Why Protestants Agree With Mormons? Part Five
"Here are some examples. [Part four of eight]
The Great Apostasy
The LDS Church believes that the Priesthood and parts of the true gospel established by Jesus Christ during His mortal ministry were lost in the centuries following the deaths of the Apostles. There were still faithful believers during this time that kept Christianity alive. However, some truths were lost, ordinances were changed, leaders became corrupt and The Church fell away as Paul prophesied it would in Thessalonians 2. This period is referred to as the great apostasy. The Greek word for "falling away" is Apostasia---Apostasy.
Why do Protestants believe in the Apostasy?
If it ain't broken why fix it, right? If there was not an apostasy, why have a Reformation?..... Other Reformers also sought to re-establish the "true gospel"..... Today, Protestants church shop [stop] believing one church's teachings are more in line with the Bible than others. Protestantism exists because of the apostasy." (Kelly Bingham, Why Protestants Agree With Mormons (They Just Don't Realize It), www.moroni10.com, December 7, 2007, Brackets added)
Apostasy-total desertion of one's professed principles, faith, or party.
Reformation-a change for the better.
"To the Mormon, only the Mormon church is true; therefore all other churches are "great and abominable."....Mormons teach that the power and authority was taken away from earth and was not restored until Joseph Smith made physical contact in a grove of trees with the almighty God, Creator of heaven and earth.
Implicit in the LDS church's argument is the idea that the church collapsed (or apostasized) soon after the death of the apostles and the world was separated from God. Bruce R. McConkie in Doctrine, pp. 43-44, puts that situation into Mormon perspective:
This universal apostasy began in the days of the ancient apostles themselves (2 Peter 2:1-2; and it was known to and foretold by them. Paul recorded specifically that the Second Coming would not be until this great falling away took place (2 Thessalonians 2:1-12). He warned of the 'perilous times" that should come "in the last days"; times when men would have "a form of godliness, "but would deny "the power thereof"; times when they would be "Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth" (2 Timothy 3:1-7); times in which they would be turned 'from the truth unto fables' (2 Timothy 4:1-4). Our Lord foretold the perplexities, calamities, and apostate wickedness of these same days (Matthew 24; Mark 13; Luke 21).
With the loss of the gospel, the nations of the earth went into a moral eclipse called the Dark Ages. Apostasy was universal. "Darkness covereth the earth, and gross darkness the mends of the people, and all flesh has become corrupt before my face" (Doctrine and Covenants 112:23). And this darkness still prevails except among those who have come to a knowledge of the restored gospel (Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, pp. 265-326).
The Biblical View
All this contradicts the Bible, for Jesus said He would be "with you alway, even unto the end of the world" (Matthew 28:20), and also that "upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it" (Matthew 16:18). The divinely inspired Paul also wrote, "Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, would without end. Amen" (Ephesians 3:21).
Now if Jesus promised He would be with us always and that the gates of hell could never prevail against His church, how could there have been such a universal apostasy as Joseph Smith taught? How could Jesus be glorified by His church "throughout all ages" if from A.D. 300-1830 it was drowning in apostasy ? Certainly there have been times when the church was not all it should be, but Jesus was still with it totally and prevented hell from crushing it." (Deckers Complete Handbook on Mormonism, Ed Decker, Harvest House Publishers, 1995, pp.48,49)
Ever sense the beginning prophets, apostles, and Jesus spent countless hours defending the faith. Satan has had a foot hold on the people of this world right from its beginning. After the apostles came, a continual stream of saints courageously defended the cause of Christ. It was through those who didn't give up the fight for preserving the gospel of Christ that the body of Christ was able to be continued "throughout all ages."
"No real Christian church believes that it is the "one true church." The true church is an organism, not an organization. It is the body of Christ, made up of Baptists, Presbyterians, Pentecostals, etcetera, all of whom worship the same God and believe the same essential truths. They may differ in minor things, but in the essentials they are one. They are the living body of Christ and always have been." (Ibid., pp. 49-50)
Protestantism does not exist because of an apostasy. Why? Because there never was an apostasy to begin with.
Sorry, Mormons and Protestants do not agree here either.
Why Protestants Agree With Mormons? Part Four
"Here are some examples. [Part three of eight]
Adam and Eve's Other Kids
Mormons believe that Adam and Eve had children besides Cain, Abel and the others mentioned in Genesis. I had a funny conversation with a nice Protestant lady who was appalled that Mormons would even think this.
Why do Protestants actually agree?
Hello!!! Where did we all come from if the first two people on Earth only had sons? They had to have a few daughters in there too, don't ya think?" (Kelly Bingham, Why Protestants Agree With Mormons (They Just Don't Realize It), www.moroni10.com, December 7, 2007, Brackets added)
"But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless." Titus 3:9, The Holy Bible, NIV)
Why Protestants Agree With Mormons? Part Three
"Here are some examples. [Two of eight]
Extra-Biblical beliefs
Mormons catch grief from Protestants for having beliefs that aren't explicitly taught in the Bible, like the LDS belief in eternal marriage, salvation for the dead and the three degrees of glory. Protestants hold that the Bible is the only authority on gospel doctrine.
Why Protestants agree with having extra-biblical doctrines?
There are core beliefs prevalent in traditional Protestantism that are extra-biblical. The most obvious are the Creeds......
Another extra-biblical belief is the Rapture......"
(Kelly Bingham, Why Protestants Agree With Mormons (They Just Dn't Realize It), www.moroni10.com, December 7, 2007, Brackets added)
"Creed-A brief authoritative formula of religious belief.
The Creeds and Confessions produced by the Christian Church over the centuries are not inspired additions to Scripture nor in any way replacements for the words of Christ and his apostles or the prophets which preceded them. Instead these human documents are carefully considered and usually thoughtfully worded responses to various issues, heresies and historical situations that have troubled the Church and the world over the centuries. Creeds are statements of faith that are true and authoritative insofar as they accurately reflect what Scripture teaches. Those linked here have been found useful either by the entire Church or by important segments and/or denominations of it over the ages. They are thus helpful "measuring sticks" for orthodoxy. Canons but not the canon." (http:www.creeds.net/creed.htm)
"Rapture-is a prophesied future event found primarily among conservative Protestant denominations relating to the return of Jesus. The primary passage describing the rapture is 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17. '"Rapture", in the context of eschatology, is an English word derived from the Latin rapio, "caught up" as found in the Vulgate rendering of 1 Thessalonians 4:17." (www.wikipedia.com)
"After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever." 1 Thessalonians 4:17 (The Holy Bible, NIV, italics added)
The Creeds and the Rapture are by no means "extra-biblical doctrines" as stated in the quote "Extra-Biblical beliefs".
Creeds are only statements of faith and the rapture IS scripture.
Sorry, Protestant and Mormon beliefs do not agree here either.
Why Protestants Agree With Mormons? Part Two
"...Here are some examples. [Example one of eight.]
The Bible
Protestants and Latter-Day Saints believe the Bible is scripture inspired by God. Most Protestant Sects believe the Bible is inerrant and take issue with the LDS Church belief that the Bible is the word of God as far as it is translated correctly. They really get hung up on the "as far as it is translated correctly" part." (Kelly Bingham, Why Protestants Agree With Mormons (They Just Don't Realize It), www.moroni10.com, December 7, 2007, Brackets added)
Take a look at the statement in the first sentence under this heading, "The Bible." The key word is "INSPIRED." Throw the rest away. The rest has no bearing on the important issue. I decided not to include this papers arguments about translation. They are redundant. All that is needed is the word "INSPIRED." No matter the translation, it's what God is trying to convey to the readers heart, that's what matters. I personally have many translations of the English speaking Bible. In unison, God speaks directly to my spirit. No-as far as it is translated correctly-necessary!
Why Protestants Agree With Mormons? Oh, Yeah?
WHY PROTESTANTS AGREE WITH MORMONS
(THEY JUST DON'T REALIZE IT)
By:Kelly Bingham
December 7, 2007
*Quite the title isn't it? Anyway, lets continue.....
"At first glance it appears Protestant theology and Latter-day Saint theology has nothing in common. However, there are several beliefs shared by both the LDS Church and Protestant denominations. Latter-Day Saints and Protestants believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God. That He created the Earth and was the God of the Old Testament. Jesus was born of a virgin and lived a perfect and sinless life during His mortal ministry. Both believe that Jesus offered Himself as a sacrifice and suffered horribly to atone for our sins. He died on the cross and was resurrected the third day, freeing us all from the bonds of death. Mormons and Protestants also both believe in morality and the sanctity of marriage and family.
There are some LDS beliefs that some Protestants politely disagree with like salvation through both grace and works. Then there are those Mormon doctrines that really get under Protestant's skin and drive them berserk Ironically, they believe in some of these same beliefs but didn't know it because they hadn't looked at them from a different perspective. Here are some examples." (Kelly Bingham, www.moroni10.com, December 7, 2007)
For right now I'm going to leave the examples out. They will be covered separately in their own post. There are eight examples all together. I need to clarify the statements made above then move onto the examples.
*Yes Protestants believe that Jesus is the Son of God, however, the LDS believe that Jesus is not the ONLY son of God, just the first. (At least the only one that got to be called a God before he had a body.)
*LDS believe that Jesus is the God of this earth only. Jesus is not to go off and make spirit children to inhabit other worlds, while all of His spirit brothers and sisters can.
*LDS believe God the Father came down and had physical sex with Mary (because the LDS believe that God the Father can take a wife at His discretion, and there is no other way for a baby to be conceived. You see, the LDS still believe in Polygamy, it will be practiced in heaven. Sorry women, there is just too many of you.), thus only making her a virgin up to that point.
*LDS believe that Jesus did the suffering in the garden of Gethsemane not on the cross, and Jesus only atoned for Adam's sins, not all the sins we've committed (plus our sinful nature, we all have it, we're born with it, can't change that fact, it's due to Adam and Eve.), plus they believe that there are a few sins that Jesus cannot atone for, your own blood must be spilt.
*LDS believe that we are freed from death, it is the only thing Christ did by His resurrection.
*LDS believe that you cannot get into the highest glory of heaven if you do not observe their moral codes at all times, whatever the prophet deems them to be.
*LDS believe that you cannot get into the highest glory without being married or without having children. Without them, you would be only worthy of lesser glories.
*LDS believe that works gets you into heaven, not grace.
The introduction in this essay is not correct when it states, "Protestants believe the same as LDS."
LOVE IS........
Tender
Patient
Kind
It does not envy
It does not boast
It is not proud
It is not rude
It is not self seeking
It is not easily angered
It keeps no record of wrongs
It does not delight in evil
It rejoices with the truth
It always protects
It always trusts
It always hopes
It always perseveres
Love cannot be quenched
Love is as strong as death
Love is simple
Love stands firm
Love endures forever
Love never fails
Love is the fulfillment of the law
Love does not harm its neighbor
Love is the fruit of the spirit
Love is a virtue
Love is a breastplate
THE GREATEST OF ALL IS LOVE, and so then what is LOVE?
GOD
A Disease Called Pride
"We must stop wanting elaborate buildings and temples just to bolster the pride of Church members in areas in which they happen to live." (Theodore M. Burton, Assistant to the Council of the Twelve, "A Disease Called Pride," Ensign, Mar 1971, 26)
Sorry Theodore, but it looks to me that the LDS Church ignored your words. The church didn't take heed to the Assistant to the Council's, council. These buildings and their interiors are very elaborate and expensive. I'm sure the Mormon church doesn't want anyone to know how much all of their buildings costs. Their buying the stairway to heaven, NOT!!!!
A Serio-Comic Poem
A man it is said, who is very erratic,
And bordered on what has been called "the fanatic;"
Still, it cannot be said of the sheep-stealing thief,
That he did not hold scared this shameful belief,
For one who was simply a liar and cheat,
In the struggle that followed, was sure of defeat;
Yet this singular creature, at no time affrighted,
By the tempest of wrath, that his preaching excited,
Never veered from his course for a friend or a foe,
But completed his scheme ere death laid him low;
And left to this nation, for "better or worse,"
A legacy voted the world's greatest curse,-
A monster well known as of barbaric fame,
Brought forth in pollution, and reared up in shame.
(Peter F. Dodds, Mormonism, A Serio-Comic Poem, Mt. Pleasant, Mich., North Western Tribune, 1890, pg.14)
